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Thread: Constitutional Carry

  1. #11
    eCosS's Avatar
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    If you are for gun control, then you are not against guns, because the guns will be needed to disarm people. So it’s not that you are anti-gun. You’ll need the police’s guns to take away other people’s guns. So you’re very Pro-Gun, you just believe that only the Government (which is, of course, so reliable, honest, moral and virtuous…) should be allowed to have guns. There is no such thing as gun control. There is only centralizing gun ownership in the hands of a small, political elite and their minions.

  2. #12
    Bottom Frag Hero Hawk's Avatar
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    I'm for legal gun ownership; I have been personally looking into a small pistol for my own protection and in Wisconsin legal ownership allows you to open carry (unless in a vehicle which all weapons are required to be concealed to avoid unnecessary assumed threat to officers on traffic stops) and you have to apply for gun ownership either with the state before picking up your weapon or at the store where they will put your application in during the buy process and can take anywhere from 15-30 minutes to be approved or denied. You will rarely be denied unless you are convicted felon or if you have multiple counts of DUI.

    Conceal carry is relatively new here and requires a course on gun safety, which makes sense concealed weapons are more difficult to draw leading to more accidents. Your average gun owner will not encounter these issues should they be wearing an open holster for their weapon.

    The bylaws of wisconsin allow businesses to disallow open carry and conceal carry tho many just disallow open as it's too difficult to enforce it on conceal unless you have an active metal detector and guard. I know this because I do currently carry a knife with me at all times, and nearly had it confiscated when I forgot we were going a theater with active security details. (this of course doesn't apply to officers of the law.)

    But that's all just a lot of guff, and the TL;DR is that statistics show that the amount of violent crime is down, inverse to gun ownership increasing. That means that stats essentially prove a lot of gun-rhetoric false. You do not get more violent crime when the population is more armed.

    In fact a bigger contributing factor to Americas relatively high gun violence is the proportion of Gang Violence and the amount of Gangs we have in the states; People who legally cannot own guns, because most have felony charges.

    I live in a shit neighborhood in a shit part of Wisconsin, my wanting a gun has nothing to do with power, or manliness or whatever other stupid idea people have it's down to one thing and one thing only: Gangs exist in this part of my state.

    There have been violent crimes in my neighborhood, the gas station up the street was robbed at gun point; the mcdonalds was robbed with a knife.

    We have a powered keypad lock on our back door, we have a camera on our front door to see who rings it, we have a home security system that is hooked up to a cell phone so phone lines can't be severed to render it useless. All of this only stops people getting in the doors however. So for the inside we have a handgun my mother keeps at her bed side and I have my knife.

    There are a lot of tools to use to protect yourself, but when all else fails there is one potent tool that levels all playing fields and can be the difference between life and death: a gun. Doesn't matter the size, doesn't matter the caliber.

  3. #13
    Misha's Avatar
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    ^100% agree with everything you stated. I carry every day, and not because of some false sense of ego or machoness or whatever. I carry because if I can stop an innocent life from being taken in the hands of a criminal, I will do so. I don't EVER want to be in the situation where I need to, but if it comes down to it, I will not hesitate.

    I grew up in North Minneapolis. I have been robbed at gunpoint, stabbed, beat up, you name it. I was always a target. Now, as an adult, I refuse to be a target. Period.

  4. #14


    haiqtpi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Misha View Post
    I carry because if I can stop an innocent life from being taken in the hands of a criminal, I will do so. I don't EVER want to be in the situation where I need to, but if it comes down to it, I will not hesitate.
    Here is my issue with that mentality: it is anecdotal--that is, based on your own experiences, you have formed your own judgments and, more importantly, biases. You have a predetermined frame of mind that you will take into situations, and I think that this is a red flag. As someone who lives in NYC, for example, there are so many people who are injured as innocent bystanders when police engage criminals with their own firearms. While police can always use more training, the fact is that they DO train in these kinds of encounters, and regardless of how many "classes" you take, or however much time you spent in the military, you are not prepared or trained for this kind of encounter. A gun makes it very easy to bypass the whole process of rational thought and analysis of situation. How are you qualified to judge whether or not someone's life is/is not in danger? I pose the same question with your already formed mindset of why you carry a firearm.

    In a perfect world, yes, there should not be an issue for wide spread gun use, but that assumes responsibility, and more importantly, self-control. Humans are fucking scary animals, and I think that allowing people to carry weapons which can end a life in an instant, is a fucking horrible decision. I must admit, it makes me so uncomfortable how so many of the "pro-gun" lobby all tend to describe themselves as Chuck Norris, and that anyone who fucks up with guns are simply untrained idiots--this simply is not reasonable, let alone statistically possible. People assault others all the fucking time, and you want to tell me that people should be carrying handguns all willy-nilly? People get drunk, people get high, people get fucking angry. Think about all the shit that humans do to each other without weapons, and then imagine those same people carrying weapons. It is so illogical, and frustration only increases exponentially when I acknowledge that no matter how logical/illogical something is, that guns are so deeply ingrained in the American psyche that they will never go away, much to my dismay.

    Edit: I'd also like to point out what happens when we have a tendency to confront with firearms--just check out police shooting statistics.
    Last edited by haiqtpi; 07-04-2017 at 06:46 PM.
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  6. #15
    Misha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by haiqtpi View Post
    Here is my issue with that mentality: it is anecdotal--that is, based on your own experiences, you have formed your own judgments and, more importantly, biases. You have a predetermined frame of mind that you will take into situations, and I think that this is a red flag. As someone who lives in NYC, for example, there are so many people who are injured as innocent bystanders when police engage criminals with their own firearms. While police can always use more training, the fact is that they DO train in these kinds of encounters, and regardless of how many "classes" you take, or however much time you spent in the military, you are not prepared or trained for this kind of encounter. A gun makes it very easy to bypass the whole process of rational thought and analysis of situation. How are you qualified to judge whether or not someone's life is/is not in danger? I pose the same question with your already formed mindset of why you carry a firearm.

    In a perfect world, yes, there should not be an issue for wide spread gun use, but that assumes responsibility, and more importantly, self-control. Humans are fucking scary animals, and I think that allowing people to carry weapons which can end a life in an instant, is a fucking horrible decision. I must admit, it makes me so uncomfortable how so many of the "pro-gun" lobby all tend to describe themselves as Chuck Norris, and that anyone who fucks up with guns are simply untrained idiots--this simply is not reasonable, let alone statistically possible. People assault others all the fucking time, and you want to tell me that people should be carrying handguns all willy-nilly? People get drunk, people get high, people get fucking angry. Think about all the shit that humans do to each other without weapons, and then imagine those same people carrying weapons. It is so illogical, and frustration only increases exponentially when I acknowledge that no matter how logical/illogical something is, that guns are so deeply ingrained in the American psyche that they will never go away, much to my dismay.

    Edit: I'd also like to point out what happens when we have a tendency to confront with firearms--just check out police shooting statistics.
    I agree with what you're saying completely. I would never assume someone's life is in danger, nor would I approach an altercation that doesn't involve myself until a deadly weapon presents itself. Even then, I have a duty to retreat in the state of Minnesota as we don't have a "Stand Your Ground" law.

    I also don't believe that the 2nd amendment just gives every person the "right" to carry a pistol. I think it would be a terrible idea and more vetting should be in place to ensure that only rational people can carry.

    Though, I haven't been in that high-stress situation. You are right though, guns will never go away in America. This has become a scary place, hence why I would like to have every tool I can to defend my life and the lives of others should that situation arise. My firearms will always be the absolute LAST resort to any situation.

  7. #16

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    I'm pro-gun.

    In fact, I'm so pro-gun, I think everyone should be legally required to own a gun, know how to safely use, and safely handle a gun. There would probably be way less accidents that involve people accidently shooting someone while mishandling a gun if people knew how to be responsible with one. Guns aren't toys, and people should be responsible when using them. People shouldn't be ignorant about guns just because they don't like guns.

    If everyone has a gun, more criminals would be deterred from committing crimes if they know that the person they will commit a crime against has a gun and can defend themselves.

    Edit: Also, keep guns out of the hands of crazy people. If people can't be expected to handle guns responsibly, they shouldn't have them.

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