What are you looking for in a pet-based web game?

[esperanto]

I don't mean this question as "What would you like to see Neopets add/get rid off/change etc."

What I do mean suppose a new pet site was released. Would you like to see a human avatar as well as pets? Customizable pets or no? Bigger emphasis on housing and easier customization of such? A battling system? Different worlds or a singular world? In-game trading for USD or keeping the black market alive? Guilds, Chatting boards or malleable chat rooms? Static pets or evolving pets? A limited number of pets requiring more accounts or an unlimited number with the option for only one account? A trade center, auctions, user shops, or none of the above? Personalized user lookups or a personalized "about me" page linked from a standard UL? Plots? Flash games? Nom-flash games? Avatars? Trophies?

Which things are most important to you and which would you not want to see?

I'll add more thoughts as I think of them ;)

You don't have to answer every single one of the above, it's mostly just for generating ideas. Please let me know if you've any ideas I haven't listed as well ^_^

[John]

I like pretty things.

[esperanto]

I like pretty things.

This isn't about me right now John :P

---------- Post added at 04:43 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:03 PM ----------

Lalalalala

[esperanto]

Bumping! +rep for good responses!

[Death]

Battling systems are what draws me to a pet site which I intend to play legitly. Ability to cheat at other things is what draws me otherwise.

I like Icepets feature of a pet color & species "closet." Once your pet has been any given species and color combination, you can change them to anything else you want, so long as they have previously been that color and species combination.

I like human avatars, providing they fit with the story of the world. If the world's background doesn't involve the pets actually being "pets" of a human, they shouldn't exist.

Customization is better than static pets, but I'd like to see a site where your pet evolves somehow in combination with customization. I don't really chat much on pet sites, so if there is some sort of user shop with no limit for pricing so that I don't have to deal with haggling with someone over a price for something, that simplifies things IMO.

[esperanto]

Thanks Mondale, +repped :)

[Death]

LOL. Didn't see the +rep thing. I was wondering why I got repped. Thanks BB =)

[DarkByte]

Random Items from creatures , give each a loot % also make some items really rare im talking like 0.5% values.. This will increase there item prices and also add a fun aspect to hunting.

Now you dont wanna do what neopets does , don't flood the market with items that are supposed to be expensive because if level 1 players can have the best set in your game in a few days whats the point? The best way to do this is to add a min selling price you would be happy for each item to sell for. Make npcs / shops buy the items at your lowest price. This way it will be pointless for experienced players to sell there super rare items for any less than the value the npc buys at.

Death Penalty:
The death penalty should be severe not to harsh but its ok to make the player loose a days work in death. Trust me it works alot better for you if death is a major event that takes alot of work away from the player. Also it can be a selling point for premium accounts , just add a premium blessings to decrease death penalty for upgraded players.

I will throw some more up if you want later I had alot of problems with my own game I had to deal with :P but mine was not a pet site xD.

[Dom~]

Flash games and trophies add alot to a site, especially on like neo depending on what kind of trophy it is, you get NP,
that is something that attracts me to a site, customizing pets is also a nice thing...Oh and like a forum type thing, like
the neoboards? BUT make it so its not so Nazi Strict like neopets meaning you cant say certain things without getting ruined
from it....

[DarkByte]

Yeah ^ problem is there aimed at mums usually and they just do not want the complaints especially being linked to nickledeon.

Maybe make a more mature pet site aimed at adults not kids. Remember the generation that grew up playing game boy pokemon games are now of about the right age to have there own credit cards... :D

[esperanto]

Thanks for the feedback Domenick and Rare! +repped you both ;)

[esperanto]

Buuuuump :rolleyes:

[M.V.P]

esperanto , really battling is my first love , so battling is a must , i dont like games in which you just have to feed your pet or just customize , but adventure /mystery i.e in the forms of plots or exploration of new worlds to obtain new items would also be cool. Chatting boards are a necessity :p. Im all for the black market B)
Userlookups YES , i also like sub-games in which we can earn points and trophies.
Evolving pets would be awesome , kinda like Pokemon , we gain xp from battling , reach a certain level and the pet evolves , come to think of unlimited no. of pets would be cool like a pokemon game which can be played online with elements of neopets :D

[esperanto]

M.V.P., thanks for the response! I +repped you ;)

[tchaikovsky]

As I said in the other thread, the game mechanics as a whole would have to be inherently mirroring that of neopets. There's a finite tuning to everything on the site that wouldn't be possible in any other setting. For example, the battledome is rewarding to players that put in hours of hard work and effort, which keeps people coming back to the site; but that goal is only there given that the methods of gaining wealth / training your pet cost a lot of money.

Same thing goes for avatar collecting. While it's got a reputation for frivolity, you do have to work very hard in order to gain all those little 50 x 50's. It also puts values in certain items, and encourages users to check out the neoboards.

On the topic of neoboards, on the topic of "the neopets theory," these have to be the backbone of what makes the site what it is. Without the neoboards, users can't connect, and once they do, they get jealous. They start to wonder, 'Hey, I wish I had 20 million!' and 'Hey, I wish I had that avatar!' This creates the competition and livelihood of the community that motivates people to partake in the activities that take long hours to be successful at; thereby addicting them to the site.

As far as USD trading goes, I don't think it's a good idea to implement this. If you truly want a recreation of the neopets environment, everything (legitimate) would have to be attainable in two manners: Slow, painstaking flash games, or Fast, trading and restocking. The two player groups of those who have visited the neoboards and those who have not are tipped towards those who haven't, and the people that learn to make money at a more developed level goes down even more out of the other group. This means there's a few people restocking, and a lot of people working to buy their items; which makes the restockers competitive, and the masses have something to work for.

Giving players objectives to work for that require strenuous amounts of online time is imperative to a consistent user base. Having to save 1 million for a paint brush, or 16 million for a draik / krawk (6 months ago) is for a large part what kept a lot of people coming back. In the process of working towards these, they have a chance of assimilating into the social parts of the game and becoming attached to it, which is why we have users on the boards sporting 130+ months and on.

What I do mean suppose a new pet site was released. Would you like to see a human avatar as well as pets?

No, because this would turn away a lot of people. The anonymity that is default, a lack of association with reality, is a large proponent of increased social activity.

Customizable pets or no?

Possible, but not a focus- For reasons why, see neopets.com population charts from 2006-2013. :rolleyes:

Bigger emphasis on housing and easier customization of such?

Housings pretty much a gimmick in all honesty, as with the proper set up of pets, they aren't worth much. Yeah, they're neat, but no, you can never actually interact with them actively (and if you could, it would get boring), so it loses appeal all together.

A battling system?

Battling, in the neopets sense of the word, is a fine-tuned method of making people work in every way. Training your pet, battling your pet, and getting weapons for your pet all require time and dedication to evoke success, which means a loyal user base that wants to. As well, plot centered wars pitting fellow players together would increase competition for people that already do battle, and entice more people into getting hooked on the activity as well.

Different worlds or a singular world?

Multiple worlds brings the opportunity for many games, site features, and plots, which are integral to keeping the climate of the site active.

Guilds, Chatting boards or malleable chat rooms?

Boards and guilds only, as the value of person-to-person contact is less when you don't have a identifying post to go with your name; for instance, when I see giver_of_gifts_again post, I know that they'll have CC signature and a cliffhanger avatar. That kind of familiarity isn't shared in a chat room.

Static pets or evolving pets? A limited number of pets requiring more accounts or an unlimited number with the option for only one account?

Static pets, as there's a "time limit" on how interesting your pet can be if it's the latter. If pets can change over time, then that means that long-term playing is discouraged, due to people hitting the end of their pets' evolution. Better to have set attributes assigned to the pet that players can indefinitely increase in comparison with their friends pets, other peoples pets, or goals they have for themselves. Users should be confined to their pet and their pets only, and in order to emphasize the attachment a user needs to have with it, there shouldn't be an unlimited number; as well, facilitated pet transferring should be frowned upon in light of people receiving pets they have not worked for. Pound trading would still be possible, but safe transferring should not.

A trade center, auctions, user shops, or none of the above?

All of the above, and an emphasis on markets as well; malling is an important part of the "casual user" experience.

Personalized user lookups or a personalized "about me" page linked from a standard UL?

UL's should be all-encompassing and contain all the information about a person, and there's no need for an external page. As some already do, if you really feel it necessary, you can make a petpage if you feel like it describing yourself; but the user lookup should be mandated to concisely display a users attributes to all people that wish to view them.

Plots?

Most definitely, as prizes and activities within the plots motivates people to keep on coming back to attend every single site event.

Flash games? Nom-flash games?

Both, because some basic but popular "card / luck" style games don't necessarily need to be flash; IE bilge dice. Keep in mind that the majority of incoming users are going to head straight to the games room, and flash games need to be high in quality because of that.

Avatars?

The avatars on neopets are very specifically made out to be as popular as they are given their size and quirks; they are small, but communicate a lot and are generally physically appealing. Having avatars is the first step for people to get out of the "I want XX paint brush" phase and into "I want to collect YY avatars" level of involvement on the site. However, dilution of their properties can make them lose their value in the average persons point of view.

Trophies?

Yes, as they represent a meter by which advanced users can compare themselves to the rest of the population. It also represents a way by which people can make their account look better, which becomes a focal point in ones' goals as they get more and more into the site.
-x-

Kind of long winded, but I figured detailed responses are important if they end up becoming a reality. Just remember, when in doubt, copy neopets... Honestly. There's nothing better you can do than mimic the web's #3 trafficked site in 2003. ;)

[esperanto]

tchaikovsky, thanks so much. I fully +repped you and I'll be responding more fully in our PMs. ;)
I'll be able to talk more easily later today when I'm not as busy.

[Nik]

tchaikovsky

That was perfect, seriously.
Neopets is completely about competition between users and having infinite room for growth.

esperanto

By simply making boards and copying the neopets style marketplace; user shops, main shops, trades and auctions as well as a way by which you can show your wealth through galleries, pets and battling (among other things) you will make an awesome site.

Also customisation for user pages is important :)

Tell me how your project is going via PM maybe? I would love to watch this thing grow or maybe even be a part of it :D I can do quality digital art if you need any artists?

[tchaikovsky]

tchaikovsky

That was perfect, seriously.
Neopets is completely about competition between users and having infinite room for growth.



Thanks! I have done a lot of analysis in my free time as to what makes neopets tick, and I'm glad I nailed all the points; agreed on your thesis there.

esperanto, I look forward to learning about what you've got going on. Sounds good! :)

[Nik]

tchaikovsky
esperanto

It's also important to have tons of items, each item needs to serve a specific purpose though.
Food, Quest, Battle, Customise related items ect.
Everything needs be able to be used in some way and help the player. Junk items in neopets only help fill galleries and get the packrat avatar.

[tchaikovsky]

tchaikovsky
esperanto

It's also important to have tons of items, each item needs to serve a specific purpose though.
Food, Quest, Battle, Customise related items ect.
Everything needs be able to be used in some way and help the player. Junk items in neopets only help fill galleries and get the packrat avatar.


Agreed. I think neopets had the same idea, which is why they have only managed to amass 50k+ items after 13 years or so. However, it'd be hard to find intrinsic uses for every single item.

[Nik]

tchaikovsky

There may be some way around this, maybe some kind of luck based item fusing system.
Got any other ideas?

[tchaikovsky]

Nik

The proliferation of many items on the site is not necessarily a bad thing, but as you said, that may be an interesting avenue to take to spice things up with some of the more stagnant items. There's a certain sense of a curiosity that having new items brings to the average user, and although usability may be only high on more elevated levels of play, having multitudes of filler stuff is important.

The cooking pot comes to mind when you mention item combining, and there are some really awesome items out there with unique properties; like NCB working only against chia's. However, other items like spoppy, mixed petpets, etc. only serve as much usefulness as their ingredients, but are neat in how you create them anyway.

[Nik]

tchaikovsky
esperanto

Yeah, I guess theres nothing too bad about having less useful or useless items.

I've also been thinking, I think it's important that this site offers something that neopets doesn't offer.
I think that it would be wise to aim the site towards teens and adults, still make the game accessible for kids/everybody.
Don't let it look like it's made for 5 year olds though. Neopets wasn't originally created for kids anyways :D

[tchaikovsky]

Totally agreed. However, it should still be approachable by all audiences... For example, people shouldn't just be able to throw out profanities and such all over the boards. Yeah, the rowdy users will like it, but it'll darken the community as a whole. Improvements I can see over a neopets-style set of rules really just requires moderation that isn't completely ridiculous.

Honestly, to start out, there shouldn't be much problem with a user base... If it is enough like the old neopets, people will just come streaming in for no pretense other than nostalgia's sake. Past that it'd have to be good enough to where people told it to their friends, etc. etc.

[Nik]

Yeah neopets is controlled to the extent where people are scared to do anything, People are frozen for everything and nothing.
Also responsive staff would be nice!
Incorporating good user suggestions into the game similar to what was done when Neopets first started would be awesome as well.

I agree, all audiences should be able to play. It just needs to appeal to older audiences visually right?

[Persephone]

I really really like the customization aspect of neo, but I also think it became the only thing they cared about. It's a good way to generate profit for your site, and I'm fairly sure it's one of the only reasons neo still works. They have to generate googobs of money, and it's ridiculously addictive. I'm not saying it should be a HUGE part of a new site, just saying that it's definitely something to consider. Everyone on neo has their own niche. I personally love customizing, collecting avatars, battling, and restocking.

Restocking on neo is a fantastic system. I like that they have both things like the attic and things that are random, I think having a method of clearing out backlogged shops would be beneficial however, because that's one of the bigger issues with neo now.

I don't think there necessarily have to be human avatars, although I love dressing up mine on Subeta... which could be because I like customization in general.

For the most part I think like tchaikovsky said, looking at neo for good ideas is the best place to start. They have to have something going for them to still be surviving after all of this. Creating an atmosphere of being better than your neighbors and competition is why people keep coming back. Things like kadding, restocking, battling, avatars etc are all different niches people like to fill.

I also LOVE chatting in guilds/on boards, so I would love if this was implemented, along with Plots. Things like that build community.

I would love to help out/etc. I'm sure you could really find some amazing support, and as long as you're not stepping on any licensing toes, you have a lot of potential. Clraik has some amazing artists already, and you could always draw the attention of more. Content is definitely something that draws people in, both through restocking/prizes. I think looking at Subeta/Neo and seeing what works & what doesn't work is an excellent place to begin.

[tchaikovsky]

I think older audiences are important, but keep in mind, the only older people willing to start taking care of a virtual pet are people that are from neopets. It's a very inherently childish idea behind the whole premise of the site, but it does work; however, it'd have to be able to retain younger people or else be nothing due to a lack of players.

[sinnerog]

Personally, I like things I can collect.

[TinCan]

3D real time. Basically the same thing it is now, except open world like Runescape.

That way they can rip off kids even more :D! (I'm being sarcastic...I really hate sites who manipulate kids)

[Kite]

Cats...

Definitely evolving pets with branching evolutions would be nice in my opinion but make them hard to achieve to be actually worth something.. like unconverted pets I guess sorry I can only really compare to neo, also I think having a player character and customization would be best but maybe add some stuff for customizing pets later on... anyways as long as the player avatars don't look like Gaia I wouldn't have much to complain about

Also live chat rooms in certain parts of the site would be great since neoboards are the worst thing ever invented... I miss the ones they had in the shops back in the day :(

if you could just make a new neopets website that followed all the same plots etc that would be great I'm sad there are things that I'll never be able to get namely plot/retired trophies and avatars

^don't do this


Also... if you do implement a shop like system, definitely make it so auto-buyers etc. can be used from day one even if it means entering a captcha on each purchase. This means more people will spend more time actively playing on your site and also make it so there's less of a chance of a small group of people.. namely us, being in possession of the majority of useful and desirable items.


Lemme know if and when you start alpha/beta testing :D

---------- Post added at 12:59 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:53 AM ----------

Just thought of something else... instead of having so many useless boring flash games

Maybe make something reminiscent of pokemon where you use your creature to gather items and battle against other creatures.. this could be supplemented with the same kinds of luck games and wheels/scratchcards etc and it would probably be a lot of work but I'd definately rather play a decent version of neoquest/pokemon than petpet battles or hannah and the pirate caves etc.

[Oshawott]

I think a site for me just needs to be friendly, none money orientated and have a good staff team. Unfortunatly I don't think these attributes are enough anymore with the petsite community on the down.

[Daenery]

I'd like a site that didn't encourage tattling left and right and didn't make it so hard to start from scratch. I've never been banned for scamming or hacking on Neopets but it's so easy to get a warning for even the dumbest things. I just think it's dumb how the site is so focused on being perfectly kid friendly that there's little to no room for older players to joke around without risking a warning and how it's so easy to get warned for things that seem tame to me. And of course, unfair freezings will lead to bitter feelings and a larger population of people who'd rather not play by the rules anymore since it got them nowhere. It's ironic since I think Neopets originated as a college-age oriented game?

Besides kids who steal their parents' credit cards I think they'd make far more money if they catered to the young adult+ population because those are the people most likely to have jobs and/or sources of disposable income. But idk, I don't know any statistics. xd