Guy (03-11-2015)
I think the feminism we have today is very convenient for corporations/the rich and I'm not a feminist expert but I wouldn't be surprised if the feminist movement was supported and pushed by corporations. (I mean, when it initially started)
Women entering the workforce was convenient for them because there were more workers, and therefore their labor costs went down..
I'm going to sound like I'm some modest individual who's stuck in 1930, but feminism really is in a way a destruction of the household. But of course household production is not included in market activity...and this is inconvenient for people pushing consumerism. Feminism really has caused a lotttttttt of economic problems and unhealthier families (physically/mentally)
Anyways, feminism to me...well, I don't look a gift horse in the mouth. But I am not an active participator in any women's rights movements, I don't care. but I see it as a big money making facade
Last edited by Sociopath; 03-10-2015 at 08:21 PM.
Guy (03-11-2015)
"Another example, feminists who tell women they shouldn't be stay at home moms."
eeep! that is absolutely not what feminism is about!
i'm too lazy to explain, and english is not my first language but there are different schools in feminism.
but i guess 'stupid' people re-appropriated the idea of 'feminism' and they are louder, thus making people think being a feminist is a 'bad thing'. it's not only about 'stong empowering dominant women' it's about 'all women/female gender' .
no one should 'dictate' what you have to do as a female gender. but i also think it's important to protect womens right for instance.
When I was young and naive I was a person that didn't believe people should be stay at home moms, I've only mentioned it once in real life and I remember my senior year economics teacher in high school getting very wide eyed about what was coming from my mouth...
But now that I understand more of the costs of childcare compared to the opportunity costs of putting your child in daycare, I understand it more. I still don't necessarily agree with women who have degrees and paid a lot of money for them staying home...especially in more high paying jobs like engineering or a good masters degree
And I don't mean the type of women that pops two kids out 18 months apart and then sends them off to school at 5 and goes back to work.
I mean more so the women who have one kid, then wait 4 years to have the next...and then another 4 years, and then the last one 3 years later. While being highly educated. What exactly was the point of you going to school if you are just going to be a stay at home mom? (granted not a LOT of highly educated women in high paying jobs do this, I find that more educated women are eager to get back to work after baby but they exist)
If you got your degree for basically nothing, I see the point. but if you got into 70,000 getting your bachelors and aren't going to use it...I just don't get that. We all have probably met a woman with a tribe of kids and just before her youngest is about to go to kindergarten...SURPRISE
Could be protection if the marriage fails, but it's also better to prepare for failure through earning an income...but no one prepares for the failure of their marriage
If you want an education, there's plenty of youtube videos online that don't cost thousands of dollars.
stay at home moms are very productive, just not for the market
Last edited by Sociopath; 03-11-2015 at 05:03 AM.
yea tbh feminism is good enough when being done right but there is a ton of feminists who only go around empowering white chicks / TERFs / feminists who go around shaming housewives so it can be pretty nasty but feminism in itself isnt bad
(you need an account to see links) Susan B. Anthony was a real delight (sarcasm). I had heard about this recently and decided to look into it. She believed that white women would be better voters than black men, and male immigrants.
What angers me about the feminist movement, is that even though Susan B. Anthony is no longer alive, feminism was driven by white women for white women. That doesn't mean all suffragists were white. However, these black women were fighting for one group's right to vote, and no one else's. Black women could not vote until the 1960's. This was not equality, this was racism in disguise.
The fact remains that I just have far too much wisdom, therefore, it prevents me from being a feminist. I understand that women are going to choose how they live their lives. I understand that men who want a woman to do what they tell them is unacceptable. I understand that not every man who flirts with me or asks me on a date wants to rape me. I understand that we are attracted to different things, and our normal, healthy choices of what we find attractive are our business, not a feminist's. I am a grown-ass woman, and I do not need anyone to tell me how I feel, how I live, how I dress, how I am treated, how much of a "victim" I am and how much of a woman I am.
EEL SUSHI
I think the whole idea of feminism got warped into something ridiculous when gender roles really started breaking down at the turn of the century. It seems a lot of the extremists started taking feminism to mean that women are superior to men and all men are scum who should go DIAF. It seems to be less about equality now and more about women being overly aggressive about their 'right' to be put on a pedestal and worshiped for being a strong independent woman who don't need no man. I'm all for equality, but in general I don't feel that feminists are seeking equality anymore. I hear more and more people arguing about ridiculous 'injustices' that are still being done to women, but most of them aren't even true. Not only that, but because of this new surge of independence, I feel like a lot of men are getting their own injustices that no one's fighting against. Why are feminists not called equalists? If there are feminists and people support that, why should there not also be masculists defending the rights of men? I know that sounds backwards because, hah, men have everything easy.
But just as there are downfalls to being a woman there are downfalls to being a man. Dating, for example - men are still expected to make the first move. A lot of girls STILL wait 'for him to call' instead of taking action themselves. Men are expected to put themselves in the line of rejection which, trust me, is no less devastating for a man than it is for a woman. Men still have lower success rates in seeking child custody after divorce. While it's true that there are jobs that have historically predominantly employed men, there have also been jobs that have, historically, been 'for women'. Now, more and more woman are getting trades and doing hard physical labor, which is great if that's what they want to do, and they actually have a higher chance of being hired because employers like improving their gender equality statistics. But from another perspective, everyone woman in the workplace is one less man in the workplace. And that would be fine if society was making up for it somewhere and other jobs were starting to become flooded with men; but that hasn't really happened. You still don't see a lot of male nurses, receptionists, hair stylists, flight attendants, etc - and if you ARE a man working in a field like that, more often than not, people will assume you're gay.
I just think that people take feminism too far these days, to the point where it's actually making things less equal in a lot of cases. Of course the above is just my personal opinion.
spleef35 (03-14-2015)
@(you need an account to see links)
Its more a matter of the $ value you put in bonding and spending time with your child I would assume. You may have spent 10 years getting a doctorate, but are those years of the same value as the years and time you want to spend with your children? Besides people also get bachelors without paying to go to school
@(you need an account to see links)
What do you mean by done right? Right is pretty subjective.
In my opnion, Feminism is only as good as it attempts to level the plain field in comparison to its male counterparts. Anything more or less is a disservice
I think everyone should keep in mind that any movement is about getting some kind of benefit that a group of people think is their right or they are interested in gaining 'power'. When we think of it this way, its also easier to analyze how movements can be radicalized and the consequences it brings
@(you need an account to see links) I acknowledged in my post about people that basically get a degree for pretty much nothing and I agree it is worth it in that situation. What I don't understand is going into debt or spending the time to go as far as a masters degree just to stay at home..waste of time
gotta say it....Originally Posted by Sociopath
you know what else caused a lotttttt of economic problems? outlawing slavery.
just because something causes economic problems, does not mean it's not worth pursuing. keeping women out of the workforce may have been economically beneficial, but it was sexist. it's all about doing what makes sense for you & being able to CHOOSE what is best for you, regardless of race, sex, etc. Also, women entering the workforce did not only take away jobs from men, but it also created new jobs in childcare, etc. Now some men choose to stay-at-home. We cannot live in a static, unchanging world. Everything has repercussions, but the fact remains: everyone should have as close to equal opportunities as is humanly possible.
Last edited by Naomi; 03-13-2015 at 04:25 PM.
@(you need an account to see links)
oh yea, i shoulda elaborated. my bad! i pretty much mean what you're saying, though.
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