Gato (10-16-2020),My name is Yoshikage Kira (10-13-2020),Pidgey (10-13-2020)
This is a very interesting thread to discuss and there's many questions about.
- What're your opinions about the Illicit Drugs like Weed, Cocaine, MDMA, LSD, Meth, Psychedelic Shrooms, Heroine, Crack, Ayahuasca and many others? I know Weed is legal in some places of USA and at the Netherlands, but in general world it's illegal.
- What're or was your experiences with these?
- Do you think every drug should be legallized? Or just some of them? Or none of them?
- Do you consider alcoohol and nicotine as drugs? It should be illegal? Do you think alcoohol or nicotine are worst than any drugs? If you feel like posting data, I personally would appreciate!
- Do you believe on medicinal uses of drugs for treating some diaseases, depression? Why do you think that? You've researched about that?
- Do you think decriminalize some kind of drugs would decrease traffic and violence or would be the opposite?
- Do you know someone whose has been lost by the drugs? What I mean... the person turned someone completly different from whom you knew before.
- If you're agaisnt drugs liberation, what actions should take the law reinforcements to deal with drugs?
I've found some topics about drugs here on CK, but they were too old, so I want to came up with this discussion and I want to see your opinions about it. If you don't want to answer any of the questions because privacy, feel free to avoid it!
Mio, my cute daughter! Amazing art by (you need an account to see links), thank you very much!
Gato (10-16-2020),My name is Yoshikage Kira (10-13-2020),Pidgey (10-13-2020)
I apologize beforehand for my sucky English.
What're your opinions about the Illicit Drugs like Weed, Cocaine, MDMA, LSD, Meth, Psychedelic Shrooms, Heroine, Crack, Ayahuasca and many others? I know Weed is legal in some places of USA and at the Netherlands, but in general world it's illegal.
Yeah weed is legal here. Things like XTC are tolerated in a sense that people who are obviously high won't be thrown out (though I would sometimes like to when I'm working as bouncer) or arrested. The professional making of all drugs (sans weed for legal licensed farms) is forbidden though. But the problem is that with so many xtc, mdma, cocaine users, you have a lot of illegal labs and a lot of dumped toxic drug waste here. I think xtc/mdma should be regulated like weed, with licensed labs making those. The problem isn't gonna resolve itself otherwise (illegalization won't do shit, makes it only worse).
What're or was your experiences with these?
Did a lot of drugs when I was younger. Coke is by far my favorite. But I'm more of a booze guy (unfortunately I had huge problems with alcohol, still would if I would start drinking again).
Do you think every drug should be legallized? Or just some of them? Or none of them?
I do think "soft" drugs should be legalized wholly (so from the farm/lab to the customer, the whole chain). The main problem is hard drugs. But we are so fucking hypocrite for that matter, because alcohol IS a hard drug. It not only has the capacity to make you dependable mentally, but also physically. But everyone drinks and every store sells booze
Do you consider alcoohol and nicotine as drugs? It should be illegal? Do you think alcoohol or nicotine are worst than any drugs? If you feel like posting data, I personally would appreciate!
Like I said, yes. Nicotine as well. Makes you physically dependable, which is the definition of a hard drug. Shouldn't be illegal, but should be discouraged actively by raising a huge tax on both. And I say that as a smoker (tried soooooo many times to quit. Just couldn't quit both I guess).
Do you believe on medicinal uses of drugs for treating some diaseases, depression? Why do you think that? You've researched about that?
Well weed has been proven to be very benificiary for a lot of ailments, both mental and physical. But weed can be very dangerous as well. A cousin of mine ended up with schizophrenia triggered by smoking every day for a few years.... Never got over it Really sucks....
Do you think decriminalize some kind of drugs would decrease traffic and violence or would be the opposite?
Absolutely. You can clearly see this with weed when you compare countries that have legalized it and countries that put people in jail for years for having just a little bit of weed (looking at you USA)
Do you know someone whose has been lost by the drugs? What I mean... the person turned someone completly different from whom you knew before.
Yup... Like I said above.
Didn't answer the last one cause obviously I'm not against it.
Hope my answers are helpful to you! ^^
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Gato (10-16-2020),Lindsay Lohan (10-15-2020),Painwheel (10-13-2020),Pidgey (10-13-2020),S (10-17-2020)pa c ey G ir l
What're your opinions about the Illicit Drugs like Weed, Cocaine, MDMA, LSD, Meth, Psychedelic Shrooms, Heroine, Crack, Ayahuasca and many others? I know Weed is legal in some places of USA and at the Netherlands, but in general world it's illegal.IMO any plants such as weed and shrooms should legalized.Do you think every drug should be legallized? Or just some of them? Or none of them?
For the rest I think they should be decriminalized and treated as a health/mental health issue. No one should be in prison because of an addiction
Edit:
Wanted to add in that weed should 100% be legalized because synthetic cannabinoids (spice) are already legal and have the potential to cause some serious damage.
My mom who worked as an ICU nurse for a poverty stricken area saw numerous people in the icu after they took spice. Spice was available at nearly every gas station and party store in the area and super cheap. When you couldn't get ahold of weed for whatever reason you could always just go buy some spice. (I do think part of the reason I am getting slower is because of years of smoking spice regularly)
If the harmful synthetic is legal then there is no reason normal weed should be illegal.
With weed I’ve had a positive experience overall and it seems like all my friends that partake in it regularly have also had positive experiences. For the other not soo hard drugs (lsd, coke, mdma, amphetamines, etc) I’ve had some positive experiences too but avoid taking them for the most part to not form a habit or addiction.What're or was your experiences with these?
Yes, it'd be good to consider alcohol and nicotine in the same category as drugs because of how addictive they can be.Do you consider alcoohol and nicotine as drugs? It should be illegal? Do you think alcoohol or nicotine are worst than any drugs? If you feel like posting data, I personally would appreciate!
Alcohol addiction is pretty awful and withdrawing from it can kill you. It causes insane amounts of damage to nearly every organ long term and is sadly seen as more socially acceptable than other drug addictions. Also much easier for people to be pressured back into (have known MANY people who went through treatment and relapsed hard because of pressure from others).
Personally I have not done much research into this but from what I have read microdosing shrooms, ketamine and lsd is showing some pretty nice results. Would love to hear from anyone who has researched this more.Do you believe on medicinal uses of drugs for treating some diaseases, depression? Why do you think that? You've researched about that?
Weed/CBD have been shown to have some pretty great medical benefits. I take cbd sometimes for anxiety and it almost instantly calms me down, my roommate takes it to fight insomnia and back pain. Do I think it’s a miracle cure for everything like some claim? Fuck no
I think violence and trafficking would remain basically the same, on a similar thought I don’t think there would be a significant amount of new people doing drugs if decriminalized.Do you think decriminalize some kind of drugs would decrease traffic and violence or would be the opposite?
(you need an account to see links) the first country to decriminalize drugs in 2001 there is not data about if violent crime has increased because of decriminalization.
Do you know someone whose has been lost by the drugs? What I mean... the person turned someone completly different from whom you knew before.
Last edited by My name is Yoshikage Kira; 10-15-2020 at 10:11 AM.
Thank you to carrottea for the lovely userbar
Erik. (10-13-2020),Gato (10-16-2020),Lindsay Lohan (10-15-2020),Painwheel (10-14-2020)
I think thatpeople should do whatever they want as long as they aren't hurting someone else.
I've only tried weed a handful of times and never had any bad effects. I had a fabulous time eating until I threw up when I had the hardcore munchies (/""""@#WQweq2s - this is my cats input so it felt rude to delete it). My lack of drug experience is puely just because I know very few people and don't go out, I'd be totally down to try Cocaine, MDMA, LSD, or Psychedelic Shrooms.What're or was your experiences with these?
Legalize them all. Weed should 100% be legal, I don't feel like there is any legitimate arguement to keep it illegal. Everything should be legalized because that's the only way to guarantee that you are getting a completely pure product as there would be strict guidelines for a supplier to follow if the government was in charge. There should be legislation around who can manufacture/grow and supply, how much you can purchase within a period of time, and it should be a heavily regulated market rather than a black market or a free market. My country really stuffed up with vapes because there are so many ads everywhere which really seem targeted towards teenagers and all that does is give morons ammunition against legalizing drugsDo you think every drug should be legallized? Or just some of them? Or none of them?
I definitely consider them to be drugs and I would love for my country to actually achieve their smokefree goals so we can get rid of cigarettes as they do far more harm than good. I don't think that nicotine itself should be made illegal. I also don't think alcohol should be it's illegal but I do think that it's a bit hypocritical of people, especially politicians to drink and have it available in supermarkets but heavily oppose the legalization of other drugs.Do you consider alcoohol and nicotine as drugs? It should be illegal? Do you think alcoohol or nicotine are worst than any drugs? If you feel like posting data, I personally would appreciate!
Absolutely!!! Give the people the medical marijuana that they deserve!Do you believe on medicinal uses of drugs for treating some diaseases, depression? Why do you think that? You've researched about that?
I don't know but I don't see why it would increase it. I think that legalizing drugs would allow for a reduction in recidivism rates as people who are arrested for other reasons wouldn't get longer sentences for having previous drug charges. Don't know about that thoughDo you think decriminalize some kind of drugs would decrease traffic and violence or would be the opposite?
No, but I don't know many people. The only way to help people who struggle with addiction is legalization. Legalization means that people can seek the help that they need without fear of prosecution. One of the barriers to treatment is the fear of going to jail for admitting that you use.Do you know someone whose has been lost by the drugs? What I mean... the person turned someone completly different from whom you knew before.
Sorry don't have any references, I'm too tired to find some
I think discussions like these quickly die down because the nature of the topic lends itself to strong opinions (and judgements) on both sides of the spectrum, and the risk of social alienation is quite significant, especially in small communities like cK. For the sake of facilitating discourse and at the risk of completely destroying the few positive impressions I've made here, I'll be pretty frank and hope for the best
Do you know someone whose has been lost by the drugs?
Yes. A few childhood friends, but long after our lifepaths have parted ways. The most significant 'loss' is a fairly recent one. I found out that a family member(not blood relative, but married to immediate family) is an addict (A from now). The kind that blows through six figures of savings and drains my family and their own of every last penny. Addiction is to a 'hard' drug, supplemented by just about anything A can get their hands on. I haven't lived with A, but chose to spend some time there to help out just a few years ago. Well, fuck. I saw a moderately-intellegent human being transform into nothing but a husk of a person. I didn't know how bad it was until I saw, for myself, the uncontrollable shaking and compete loss of character. One moment that stood out was when A asked me the same question 10 or 11 times in the span of a minute and a half. I couldn't believe what I was experiencing. I've lost count of how many rehabs A has been to, and I don't think there is any hope. It's tragic, really. A was one of the kindest and most selfless people I knew, alebit somewhat simpleminded. My family, A's family have tried time and time again but there is nothing left to salvage and we have all accepted it.
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I've left some questions out, about policing drugs and the impact on crime/trafficking. I'm not very knowledgeable in these areas and am too lazy to look into it, in that way I am quite self-absorbed
Alcremie (10-16-2020),Erik. (10-16-2020),Lindsay Lohan (10-17-2020),Painwheel (10-16-2020)
I think part of the reason it hasn't gotten much attention is 1) it's a Harrison of a thread (it's been done) and 2) the OP has SOOO many questions that it's not setting up for a debate. Debate, to me, is focused on perspectives of a single issue, not a Q&A on a bunch of them. Moreover, @(you need an account to see links), it's poor form to just post a topic without giving your own opinion.
As I've made very clear before, I am anti-drugs. My earliest childhood memory involves drug use, and I never knew my father clean and sober a day in his life. So no, I have not tried drugs. I do not wish to replicate the selfish actions of my family. Personally, I think people who turn to substance use for pleasure/escapism/whatever are idiots.
I know that's a harsh perspective, but I'm not sorry for it. Drug use is idiotic and selfish. People who bitch about the legal ramifications, after knowingly breaking the law, are even more idiotic. The problem isn't with the laws. It's with the choices you made and, sometimes, the consistent and fair application of the laws. At the end of the day though, if you're not being an idiot engaging with drug use/dealing/trafficking/whatever, then hooray, you're not risking your reputation and freedom. Every day, we make choices. We need to live with the consequences of those. Boo hoo, you're an addict? Whose choice was it to begin using in the first place? Yours.
At the same time, I think that decriminalising is only going to make matters worse, because it then removes the incentive for some to not get into those things in the first place. You're going to increase ease of access to things which are then going to affect the physical, social and financial health of others. Bad plan.
You might be thinking "People make legal bad choices all the time. We can't be a nanny state and ban everything", and I agree. Unhealthy food is addictive and ruins the health of many, though I won't speak to this one here because there are underpinning issues of food affordability and poverty. Smoking and drinking are legal drugs that also fuck up lives. In Australia, they've made changes to the tobacco industry to discourage it: they put gross health warning ads on tv and on packets of cigs themselves; they have plain packaging so brand bragging didn't happen; most importantly though, they tax the ever-loving shit out of them. Pack/day habit costs $18,000/year here. The effect of these changes has been a steady decrease in smokers, (you need an account to see links). Still not the best, but getting there. My point is, societies need to think about what they can do to affect the perceptions of drug use (from cool to idiotic) and make them more difficult to obtain.
At the end of the day, are people who take drugs truly not hurting others? As in, do these people make choices that aren't affecting the financial, socio-emotional or physical wellbeing of others? They're not parents who need to care their children/partner? Or provide for them? They're not getting behind the wheel? Life is rarely as simple as that, @(you need an account to see links). I'm with you that people who truly do not harm anyone else in any way by their choices, whatever, do what you want, fuck yourself up, I don't care. But more often than not, it's not just them affected by their choices. No kid should have drugs as their earliest memory.
Last edited by Mama Bear; 10-16-2020 at 04:13 PM.
Lindsay Lohan (10-17-2020),Painwheel (10-16-2020),S (10-17-2020)pa c ey G ir l
Caffeine is a drug. Sugar is a drug. The internet is a drug. A lot of things out there are addictive. I wouldn’t consider people addicted to any of those things as idiots. That’s a very black and white way of thinking, when the world is many shades of grey. I can respect your feelings toward drugs based on your personal experiences, but thinking everyone who even uses a substance for any reason is an idiot, just because there is the potential for abuse, is an unfair assumption, and judgemental.
Anyway, weed is legal in Canada. I’ve been smoking since even before that. The world hasn’t ended here yet.
Edit: also, you are factually wrong about decriminalization. I can find sources and studies when I get home. Horrid doing this on my phone.
Last edited by Werewolf; 10-16-2020 at 04:35 PM. Reason: Fucking typos
Firstly, to clarify, I think you're exaggerating my stance. "even uses a substance for any reason" is not the same as "people who turn to substance use for pleasure/escapism/whatever". "Turn to" refers to choosing as a strategy. That's a bit different. Moreover, my examples of "pleasure" and "escapism" clearly indicate that I'm not talking about medical applications.
I acknowledged other addictive elements in society and that these also impact on people. Simply providing more examples does not provide counter-argument to what I've said. My view remains the same. Whether it's sugar, porn or crack: "people who truly do not harm anyone else in any way by their choices, whatever, do what you want, fuck yourself up, I don't care. But more often than not, it's not just them affected by their choices."
I'm not Henny Penny saying the sky is going to fall who would be surprised to hear that "The world hasn’t ended here yet." Of course it's not going to end the world.
Governments should be supporting people to kick their habits. Instead of punishing, providing medical treatment to rehabilitate them. The main argument for decriminalisation is about reducing the strain on the legal system. Yep, that's fine with me. But putting the money saved on the legal costs towards medical alternatives is a better long-term solution. There's a difference between a permissive attitude and one which still highlights that something is not what we want to be a part of our society, and providing support to get off it. Portugal had some wins and losses in their drug use after decriminalising in 2001; the main improvement was in health, which is good. However, I don't believe it goes far enough. Decriminalising alone, without a consequence (as in, mandated rehab), isn't incentive enough to change society. You're not being locked in jail as a punishment. You're being sent to mandated rehab for your own good.
Before posting the first time, I knew my views wouldn't be met with support. I know we have a lot of people in our community who partake in drug use, many quite proudly. You do you; that's your life, not mine. But if your choices are affecting others, I just can't agree with that. That is not to say I won't treat you with respect, or uphold my job as a mod impartially, or even like you. I'm friends with people whose choices I don't agree with. But the topic was about illicit drugs, and I've said my peace. I won't reply here again, because I know arguing on the internet is pointless. I won't change your minds, and there are no words that can erase my first-hand experience. I'd just like to challenge people to rethink their understanding of who it is they're actually affecting by their choices in life, be they illicit drugs, legal ones or other addictive habits.
Last edited by Werewolf; 10-25-2020 at 11:48 AM.
Lindsay Lohan (10-17-2020),Lolaloveloki (10-18-2020),Natalie (11-10-2020)
It looks like the distinction you are drawing here is that there are good reasons and bad reasons to take drugs. An espresso's worth of caffeine to jolt the senses on a sleepy morning is okay. A shot of vodka to loosen up on a Friday night is less okay. If we were to narrow the scope of the debate to that question, I'd be inclined to say (as long as the user is fully informed about the effects of the drug and is acting responsibly) there is no bad reason to take a drug.
A big problem that is closely tied to drug abuse is a lack of drug education. Young people receive an abstinence-based primer on drugs with not much nuance concerning harm reduction, safety, etc. Abusing drugs can doubtlessly have ruinous effects on personal health, family, and so on. But it seems unfair to wholly blame the user's motivations and not think about the circumstances leading up to the abuse.
I don't want to rehash the philosophy of Trainspotting entirely but to put it bluntly - life is tough. Many people live brutal lives with little to no chance at upward mobility. Even those of us who are more lucky have to deal with existential dread, unfulfillment, etc. Who would I be to judge their want for chemical pleasure / escapism? Them responsibly using a socially unacceptable drug (slot out 8 hours for a shrooms trip or an evening for a blunt) is the same as spending your time on any other vice.
That is all to say - I appreciate the personal background you gave and I see how you come to your conclusions. I also agree with your take on decriminalization and rehabilitation. I just disagree with your vice philosophy.
Gato (10-25-2020)